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T2
Admiral
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1398
Location: Ontario
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 Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 5:20 am Post subject: Fleet Location Irregularity and MS spawn at base |
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I'll attempt to explain this. Maybe it's a bug as it don't make any sense to me.
3 fleets travel to co-ords X/Y/Z. 1 fleet is a scout only. 2 fleets must go to a different location so all unwanted ships from fleet 2 & 3 is placed into fleet 1 with the scout for storage. Fleets 2 and 3 go do thier job and fleet 3 returns to where fleet 1 is sitting. Fleet 2 is still in transit back to original debarking point at X/Y/Z. Previous ships that were removed from fleets 2 & 3, and placed in the scout fleet are now returned to fleets 3 along with the scout for sake of fewer keypresses. Now I want to move the scout back into fleet 1 and send it off on a scouting mission however, I get this message
" fleets 1 and 3 do not reside in the same sector" despite the fleets actually being in the same sector.
Is this a bug? The scout should be able to go back and become fleet 1 again should it not ? If I would have moved the ships in fleet 1 all but the scout to my other fleet, the scout would have remained as fleet 1. |
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T2
Admiral
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1398
Location: Ontario
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 5:49 am Post subject: |
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Actually after playing arounda bit , I noticed I have a second mothership in my fleet 3 I brought in case something like this happened ( this is the second time it's done "weird" things with me) at co-ords X/Y/Z.
I attempt to move my second mother out of fleet 3 but the "ship move" command does not even register that fleet 3 is available to move ships in or out.
Answer to my above question of if there's a bug has now been answered affirmative.
Maybe it's because I have such an irregular fleet configuration right at this moment is why I suspect it is happening. I'm not sure I want to give away my config here as yet because I'm still hoping to send it into battle.
I'll try moving the fleet 3 1 sector , if I can, to see if the bug clears. |
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T2
Admiral
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1398
Location: Ontario
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 5:55 am Post subject: |
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Well...this is really neat...now I have an extra mothership in fleet 1 that I never brought or manufactured. Now...let's see if I can put the mother ship into fleet 3 and put my probe into fleet 1 again or even if it will register. I was able to take fleet 3 for a 15 second spin but I think the MS spawn happened before that.
----------(should have used the edit button before  )-------------
Still not able to access the ships in fleet 3 to move any ships in or out of fleet.
The newly respawned MS is now at base. I'm changing coords for fleet 3 now to determine if that portion of the bug will clear and I'll be able to split my fleet or my other option is to wait untill my fleet 2 arrives and then try to reconfigure with it. I think I'll choose ...hmmmm...both options ! |
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Star Commander
Admiral
Joined: 26 Sep 2004
Posts: 1734
Location: Bolton
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 8:13 am Post subject: |
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T2 i have something something similar to your problem in my last account so i created a new one.
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Rubens
Admiral
Joined: 20 Apr 2003
Posts: 1422
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 8:42 am Post subject: |
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no, there isnt a bug.
This is the rule "WHICH SHOULD BE MENTIONED AT FAQ OR MANUAL"
You cant "create a fleet" if you are not at your base. It means that you can certainly change ships between fleets but if you change all ships from fleet 2 to fleet 3, the fleet 2 would be empty. What does this means? It dosnt exist, so you cant move back ships from fleet 3 to fleet 2...That "fleet" which isnt a fleet because it has no ships get back to home. SO you can just put ships there when you are at the base.I hope you understood.
But it could be a bug because it hasnt a good explanation, of course this isnt new this happened years ago, i am surprised you 2 didnt realize about it before.
And the other thing that we have to mention is the "fleet syncronization" thats the problem. In an unexplainable way fleets that are sended to the same coords at the same time get lost on the subspace by minimal second and then you cant move ships between losing time and maybe points. This is a real bug, already confirmed. Thats way, when your 3 fleets are used and all of them are at a different sector the button of "move ships" dosnt appear...because you just cant do it.
Greetings. |
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Anon De Mouse
Admiral
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 943
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 11:01 am Post subject: |
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Rubens you should put that in the Noobie help section or something...
The "fleet syncronization" bug has been around for a while now, I remember it helped me in my evo when i sent all my fleets at the same time and they would attack in a different order. Now it is just annoying like everyone says.
My theory on it is that the smaller fleets just go that little bit faster then bigger fleets, although i havent tried it out yet. I think someone mentioned that before.
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just as long as you dont *** out like you did against TO |
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T2
Admiral
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1398
Location: Ontario
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 2:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | no, there isnt a bug. |
Unfortunately, it is a bug. The extra MS that appeared back at my base actually in fleet 1 was not under manufacture or in base storage.
If I have 3 fleets sitting in the same location, I normally move ships from 1 fleet to another. When I flew out with 2 fleets and return to the same coords, I used to "top up " my fleets.
I do realize what you are saying Rubans and I am aware of "SOME" of these unwritten rules, however I did not know your base is the Only place a fleet can be spawned from. Is this true?
If I carry 3 fleets to X/Y/Z, and in my ship reconfiguration, I lose a complete fleet slot while at that same X/Y/Z coords, I think it's also a bug.
Fleet 1 was originally composed of just 2 scout ships and that may be why I cannot access the fleet 1 now or turn it into a more substantial fleet with MS's and other ships I brought for that very purpose. If my scout had went off and did a trip or mission and was destroyed, I could understand not being able to respawn a "new" fleet 1 but, to have 3 fleets at a location, reconfigure and lose a slot and have to travel a couple of days just to get it back...Grrrrrr....
I accept and know that I cannot carry 2 Ms's in 1 fleet and spawn a third fleet just anywhere, however, if I travel with 3 fleets originally to X/Y/Z, no battle takes place or ship count does not change and I move my spare MS from fleet 3 to fleet 1 and probes from fleet 1 to fleet 3, I lose my fleet slot and must return to my base to establish it again. That may also be an unwritten rule and, I accept it if indeed it is not a bug but I still don't like it. The 4th MS spawning back at base is, without a doubt, not a normal occurance. |
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Rubens
Admiral
Joined: 20 Apr 2003
Posts: 1422
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 4:23 pm Post subject: |
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| T2 wrote: | | Quote: | | no, there isnt a bug. |
Unfortunately, it is a bug. The extra MS that appeared back at my base actually in fleet 1 was not under manufacture or in base storage.
If I have 3 fleets sitting in the same location, I normally move ships from 1 fleet to another. When I flew out with 2 fleets and return to the same coords, I used to "top up " my fleets.
I do realize what you are saying Rubans and I am aware of "SOME" of these unwritten rules, however I did not know your base is the Only place a fleet can be spawned from. Is this true?
If I carry 3 fleets to X/Y/Z, and in my ship reconfiguration, I lose a complete fleet slot while at that same X/Y/Z coords, I think it's also a bug.
Fleet 1 was originally composed of just 2 scout ships and that may be why I cannot access the fleet 1 now or turn it into a more substantial fleet with MS's and other ships I brought for that very purpose. If my scout had went off and did a trip or mission and was destroyed, I could understand not being able to respawn a "new" fleet 1 but, to have 3 fleets at a location, reconfigure and lose a slot and have to travel a couple of days just to get it back...Grrrrrr....
I accept and know that I cannot carry 2 Ms's in 1 fleet and spawn a third fleet just anywhere, however, if I travel with 3 fleets originally to X/Y/Z, no battle takes place or ship count does not change and I move my spare MS from fleet 3 to fleet 1 and probes from fleet 1 to fleet 3, I lose my fleet slot and must return to my base to establish it again. That may also be an unwritten rule and, I accept it if indeed it is not a bug but I still don't like it. The 4th MS spawning back at base is, without a doubt, not a normal occurance. |
There is no bug and my name is "RubEns".
in all those parragraphs you combine a player wining and a player explaining.
Yep all the things you say are true. I realized it was such a bad thing because you cant create fleets at anywhere of the universe
SINGLE EXAMPLE
FLEET 1 SCOUT
FLEET 2 A FIGHTER and a MOTHERSHIP
FLEET3 A DESTROYER and a 2 MOTHERSHIPS
In the same coords but not your base.
You want to get the MS to the fleet 1?
Well you CAN NOT put the scout at the fleet 2 and then moving the MS, if you do that the fleet 1 disapears. You first put the MS and then move the scout.
If that was your case i think its explained now. If you want to comprobe it just go 1 sector away from your base and do it. Then get back to base and do the same thing and you will see that you CAN move the ships.
It could also be a bug if you see it by the side of "this cant happen, this is not at the manual" but if so, its a bug that has years here or maybe for ever, hence it has an explanation and i dont think its a bug.
@Anon...How can i do that?
I dont trust that theories because sometimes the fleet goes at the same time. But why dont you probe on cloacking fleets and a DSP, seeing what number of ships is a small/medium/high fleet. Then go from your base to 1 sector away and do the experiments. Try to do them many times and with all the combinations. I think i can try it in some hours. But i repit you i think it shouldnt work like that
PD:you get excited with the small letters? |
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T2
Admiral
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1398
Location: Ontario
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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Well RubEns ..if you know so much please explain why a 4th MS was created in my base while I had a full fleet compliment out in space....not 1 mp left to do any ship manufacturing and nothing in my production cue line yet, still an extra MS appears.
P.S. Do not get rude with me like your last post or I'll rip you down so low you will have to look up to see whaleshit.
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Rubens
Admiral
Joined: 20 Apr 2003
Posts: 1422
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 12:27 am Post subject: |
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| T2 wrote: | Well RubEns ..if you know so much please explain why a 4th MS was created in my base while I had a full fleet compliment out in space....not 1 mp left to do any ship manufacturing and nothing in my production cue line yet, still an extra MS appears.
P.S. Do not get rude with me like your last post or I'll rip you down so low you will have to look up to see whaleshit.
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Sorry if you felt ofended i just wanted my name to be spelled right.
So, this bug has a relation with the title? No it hasnt. Maybe you didnt see a thing...or something....its a weird bug.
PD: What did you mean? You will get me in the Universe? Ok i dare you:D...I need targets;) |
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T2
Admiral
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1398
Location: Ontario
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 1:58 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | PD: What did you mean? You will get me in the Universe? Ok i dare you:D...I need targets;) |
I'm not sure where you are referencing to . I don't recall saying anything about "getting anyone". Sorry to disappoint you but you have done nothing to be on my hit list. If you want my points...I have a fleet at the BH
At the risk of spaming up the thread more, Rubens...you did not insult me. It's just your way of saying things can be construed as being rude. Perhaps it is because english is your second language.
Do you recall telling Vrictus about his posts being too...hmmm....insulting?
You are bordering on that same line.
Back to the irregularities, they are still happening but in different manifestations. My fleets arrived at the BH about 3 or 4 times again after the fleet actually arrived. I lost all control and was unable to move any ships around fleet to fleet for a few minutes until my browser reset itself.
I think it was 3 arrivals I was told about before I could actually settle down and reconfigure my wanted fleet set-up. I'm taking everything home but my BH fleet and try to clear these irregularities and start over. |
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T2
Admiral
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1398
Location: Ontario
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 4:36 am Post subject: |
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...it's just...the more info Admin have on this little problem, the better the chances are they will find it.
I suspect Renee's losing of her MS twice, the disjointed fleet time arrivals, me respawning a 4th MS could all be related problems but I cannot say for sure.
I certainly would not expect a perfect return to a rounds type system and some bugs are to be almost certain. Already though I think the effort has been worth it as the game has a much fairer system of alliance scoring despite these minor annoyances |
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Spyder
Vice Admiral
Joined: 09 Sep 2004
Posts: 565
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 5:20 am Post subject: |
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its not a bug, you cant split fleets, any spare fleet spots are always located at base. lesson is, dont combine what you later want to split.
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Rubens
Admiral
Joined: 20 Apr 2003
Posts: 1422
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 6:10 am Post subject: |
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| Spyder wrote: | | its not a bug, you cant split fleets, any spare fleet spots are always located at base. lesson is, dont combine what you later want to split. |
It was already explained and understood;)
But i think this resume it. As T2 said..can we put it at the noob subforum? This is a not written rule |
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admin
Board Admin
Joined: 09 Jan 2002
Posts: 2938
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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yes, this was a good explanation: | Rubens wrote: |
SINGLE EXAMPLE
FLEET 1 SCOUT
FLEET 2 A FIGHTER and a MOTHERSHIP
FLEET3 A DESTROYER and a 2 MOTHERSHIPS
In the same coords but not your base.
You want to get the MS to the fleet 1?
Well you CAN NOT put the scout at the fleet 2 and then moving the MS, if you do that the fleet 1 disapears. You first put the MS and then move the scout.
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it is an explanation why a fleet vanished at the point in space where you tried to move the fleets.
@T2: was this one part of your initial bug report?
but the other part, about this: | T2 wrote: | please explain why a 4th MS was created in my base while I had a full fleet compliment out in space....not 1 mp left to do any ship manufacturing and nothing in my production cue line yet, still an extra MS appears.
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are you very sure, that it happened? did you use more mp then in your fleet than you actually have?
it would be a strange bug, that never happened before.
and this in not correct: | Anon De Mouse wrote: | | My theory on it is that the smaller fleets just go that little bit faster then bigger fleets, although i havent tried it out yet. I think someone mentioned that before. |
all fleet should fly exactly the warp they have. it is a bug, that sometimes the fleets get out of sync. we have another topic about this: http://www.spacetrace.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5023 |
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T2
Admiral
Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1398
Location: Ontario
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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I'll try to re-create the situation again admin. To say, 100% I can't.
I have since had battle so my MP has changed so I can't backtrack to see if I actually have more MP than allotted.
I am 99% sure the error happened as I specifically waited extra time to let my rebuilds be complete before I pulled out of base.
I travelled with 3 fleets. 1 fleet was 2 scout ships. 1 fleet contained 2 MS's, 1 fleet contained 1 lowrider. At destination, reconfigure for dispatch. Now I can't remember exactly what transfers I attempted however when I was doing it , it was like the server was frozen. Try again and same effect...nothing....third time's lucky right ? anyhow, all of a sudden, all the commands I tried to do before, to no result, started to execute. After I got 3 post data messages, everything seemed to sort itself out but then I noticed the MS. That's about when my narrative started as well.
Somehow, a mothership spawned, I'm sure back at base in fleet 1 when the probes were being moved around and the server was "sleeping".
It could have been a combo ( 2 independant warp-type ships composing a fleet) along with manipulation orders with another warp type ship, a combo that may never happen again.
I was 99% aware of fleet limitations in regard to fleet spawns and have been exploring the boundarys a little.
I have also been seeing, more often, the fleet lag problem that I never saw before and a echo effect of when a incident is to happen. My fleet arrived at the BH 3 times before it finally was able to do stuff and it took 90 secs for all the "echos" to clear.
Probe said fleet was at the BH after initial arrival. Post data comes up. I open fleet menu and it says I am 1 min 30 secs out from BH. I look at probe screen and refresh...yep...fleets are at the hole. Look at Fleet screen. Still 1 min out approx. Fleet arrives...again.... and then everything seems normal again.
I may try to keep a log of incidents as they happen so the exact sequence of events can be tracked
Fleet arrival countdown clock goes like this... (secs till arrival) 26, 24, 25, 23, 22, 20, 21, 19, 20, 18, 19, 17, etc.
Last edited by T2 on Tue Mar 14, 2006 2:19 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Rubens
Admiral
Joined: 20 Apr 2003
Posts: 1422
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| Posted: Tue Mar 14, 2006 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Anon De Mouse wrote: | Stop spaming tough guy
| Rubens wrote: |
@Anon...How can i do that?
I dont trust that theories because sometimes the fleet goes at the same time. But why dont you probe on cloacking fleets and a DSP, seeing what number of ships is a small/medium/high fleet. Then go from your base to 1 sector away and do the experiments. Try to do them many times and with all the combinations. I think i can try it in some hours. But i repit you i think it shouldnt work like that
PD:you get excited with the small letters? |
Well just make a topic and post about the mothership thing... even i didnt know about that untill the first time you brought it up.
It was very interesting that probing thing coz i did it like ten times and it didnt really show anything ... they got out of sycn once when i tryied to move ships but most the other times they arrived at the time
And yes small letters do excite me. |
Well just quote the things said by the admin and copy them at the topic of noob help. I dont know if i want to do it   ...hard to explain.
Yep but those small letters are really good, means a lot:P...Yep Tough guy plz stop spamming...but aswell...we have to keep this alive, so...
@T2 Well, mostly of what you said are bugs that have already been reported. Dont worry.
Now the rest of it, are you sure you hadnt a MS in production queu or something like that? If you still hasnt a explanation i think its just a normal bug which is really weird.
You get extra mp because you got a ghost MS...maybe it was during the evolution-round updating?
Anyway i am sure the admn will take a look |
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admin
Board Admin
Joined: 09 Jan 2002
Posts: 2938
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| Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 9:26 am Post subject: |
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this thread definitely helps us finding the bug.
we will see in a few days. |
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